A while back I read the following quote by the then Cardinal Ratzinger, now Pope Benedict XVI, and then I couldn't find it again for a while. I recently looked it up again and found some articles on it and the original document from which the quote is taken. Following is the link to the original Vatican document and then the quote from it which really bothered me, as it seems to say that Ratzinger believes that the Messiah who is to come is not the same person as the Messiah who came 2000 years ago, but will have the same traits as He did. Following the quote are some more links discussing the document and the quote.
Does Pope Benedict believe in the second coming of Jesus Christ, or is he looking for another Messiah? Will he lead those who trust in him to follow 'another christ' who is not Jesus Christ?
Document: "The Jewish People and Holy Scriptures in the Christian Bible"
"Jewish messianic expectation is not in vain. It can become for us Christians a powerful stimulant to keep alive the eschatological dimension of our faith. Like them, we too live in expectation. The difference is that for us the One who is to come will have the traits of the Jesus who has already come and is already present and active among us." (n.21)
Here is an article on the web page of Sacred Heart University that discusses the document and some of the reactions to it. However, they don't seem to be worried about the strange wording which bothered me and a few others.
Here are some more links about the quote and the document:
http://www.fivedoves.com/letters/apr2005/donnad425-1.htm
http://zenit.org/article-3425?l=english
19 comments:
I think what the Pope is saying is that the Jews are expecting another Messiah who is different from Jesus in terms of character and personality. This is true. The Jesus we worship is generally rejected by mainstream Judaism. They are looking for a Messiah with traits different from our Jesus. JMHO. :-)
What nonsense. Do you really believe the pope believes in another Christ?
rivisionisthistory.org??? You must be kidding. A quick glance at the site reveals it to be full of the kind of anti-jewish/catholic nonsense one expects out Iran rather than anyone of intelligence.
John,
I'm going to delete the link to RevisionistHistory.org. I had found all the links I could about that quote several weeks ago and apparently forgot that I hadn't read all of them all the way through. I'm not sure what his perspective is or what the purpose of his website is, so I apologize for including that link without carefully screening it.
However, John, that doesn't negate the quote itself or the questions it raises.
Also there is a link on the fivedoves.com article to another article that expresses concern about the document because it seems to say that for some, namely the Jews, the Messiah has not yet come. Yet the Jews in general rejected the Messiah at His coming and were judged for this at the destruction of Jerusalem, 'because they did not recognize the time of their visitation.'
Hillary,
it's possible that's what Cardinal Ratzinger meant, but it's not clear, and combined with other concerns about the document as a whole and with his role as pope, which seems to continue JP2's ecumenicism that validates other religions, it is very far from clear what he meant, or how this will be interpreted in time to come.
See this other post for more concerns about papal ecumenicism:
http://pilgrimsdaughter.blogspot.com/2009/11/popes-push-for-one-world-religion-by.html
John,
just for the record, I am far from anti-Jewish or anti-Israel. I pray for the salvation of Israel and their reunion with the Bride of Christ, true Israel, the true children of Abraham. I love the Jewishness of Christ and the beautiful way Jesus Christ fulfills the Old Testament prophesies and the feasts of Israel.
I suggest you actually read the document on the vatican website. You five doves link takes one to a traditionalist catholic site that is not in union with the Church and in no way accurately represents the teaching of the Church. In fact that site is as unreliable as the link you previously deleted. Check your sources before you post.
Further, the fivedoves site is also very questionable. Loaded with all sorts of 666 nonsense. Again I suggest you read the actual document. Had you done that I do not think you would be "bothered."
Jennie wrote:
"it's possible that's what Cardinal Ratzinger meant, but it's not clear, and combined with other concerns about the document as a whole and with his role as pope, which seems to continue JP2's ecumenicism that validates other religions, it is very far from clear."
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Jennie, what is so wrong in 'validating' other religions? Religion, by definition, is man's way or attempt to reach out to God. Is it not the Christian way to show respect for others even if they have differing beliefs? Many people in these religions know of no other way to worship God. They were born into these religious systems through no fault of their own, and even in these religions God can reach them. God is never too far away to hear the cry of a broken and contrite spirit reaching out for Him.
Our job as Christians is to spread the good news of salvation and of Christ's kingdom to all the world -not judge the world. The time for judging will come soon enough.
Hillary
Hillary,
if you read the post I linked to above, 'The pope's push for a one-world religion' you may see what I'm concerned about. The problem is that the Pope has actually participated in these religions in ceremonies, and has said things that make it seem that people can come to God through their religions rather than through coming to Christ.
Just remarkable this is the only PBC document at the Vatican website available in English.
The difference is that for us the One who is to come will have the traits of the Jesus who has already come and is already present and active among us."
Isn't Ratzinger saying that we'll recognize Him when He comes again because we already know Him?
Reminds me of the words of the liturgy:
"Father, calling to mind the death your Son endured for our salvation, his glorious resurrection and ascension into heaven, and ready to greet him when he comes again, ..."
Jennie, I see your concern about the pope pushing for 'one-world religion' but the fact is 'one-world religion' will not occur under this dispensation. There is no way the various religions of the world are going to join together to become one, under this dispensation. Diverse religions will continue to exist until the blowing of the fifth trumpet in Revelation 9. The 'one-world religion' of the Bible is a new religion altogether that all persons opposed to God will become a part of.
Maybe the pope wants everybody to become Catholic? or Christian? Hey, you can't fault him for trying to get everyone to love Christ - even if they are of different religions :-)
Hillary
Teresa,
Isn't Ratzinger saying that we'll recognize Him when He comes again because we already know Him?
I don't know if that's what he's saying.
There are mixed messages being given in the Pope's words at different times, and in his actions when he bows down or prays with leaders of other religions and says they worship the same God. Muslims don't worship Yahweh, the Father, Son, and Spirit. Jews don't worship God in Spirit and truth because they have denied the Son and don't have the Spirit until they are born again.
Hillary,
I don't know what you mean by 'this dispensation'. When does this dispensation end and another one begin? We go by the signs of the times, and the signs are that the end is near and the world and much of the church will follow a false messiah under a world-wide religion. We don't know exactly how the religions will be made one, but I can get a good idea of it seeing how all the world's religions use transcendental meditation (contemplative or centering prayer) and are united in reverence and awe for the apparitions of Mary, which do not speak the truth or point to Jesus Christ as King of Kings and Lord of Lords.
The new dispensation of wrath begins under the sixth seal.
Revelation 6:12-17, NIV, caps supplied:
12I watched as he opened the sixth seal. There was a great earthquake. The sun turned black like sackcloth made of goat hair, the whole moon turned blood red, 13and the stars in the sky fell to earth, as late figs drop from a fig tree when shaken by a strong wind. 14The sky receded like a scroll, rolling up, and every mountain and island was removed from its place.
15Then the kings of the earth, the princes, the generals, the rich, the mighty, and every slave and every free man hid in caves and among the rocks of the mountains. 16They called to the mountains and the rocks, "Fall on us and hide us from the face of him who sits on the throne and from the wrath of the Lamb! 17FOR THE GREAT DAY OF OF THEIR WRATH HAS COME, AND WHO CAN STAND?"
The blowing of the final seven trumpets occur under the seventh seal (Revelation 8). The AntiChrist beast arises under blowing of the fifth trumpet (of the seven trumpets) (Revelation 9).
I hope this helps!
I understand what you've said, Hillary,
but I don't think that rules out that the signs of what is to come can begin before the actual event comes to fruition. It will not just happen out of the blue. There will be things that lead up to it that are foreshadowings.
Jenny, you are right. The foreshadowing of this new one-world religion is already beginning to take shape. There is a growing animosity in the world against traditional religions and the Bible. There is an alarming rise in idolatry, the worship of self, and human intellect over God's Word. These are only the beginnings of the new world religion.
Peace.
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