Is prayer to saints / Mary Biblical? from gotquestions.org

A reader who is Catholic told me that if I have a problem with the idea of people asking Mary and other saints to intercede for them in prayer, then I should also have a problem with asking other believers to pray for me. I found the following article on gotquestions.org and posted the first part of the article here. Please go to the link to read the entire article. I think the writer brings up many good scriptural points to refute the practice of praying to Mary and the saints or asking for their intercession.


Question: "Is prayer to saints / Mary Biblical?"

Answer: The issue of Catholics praying to saints is one that is full of confusion. It is the official position of the Roman Catholic Church that Catholics do not pray TO saints or Mary, but rather that Catholics can ask saints or Mary to pray FOR them. The official position of the Roman Catholic Church is that asking saints for their prayers is no different than asking someone here on earth to pray for you. However, the practice of many Catholics diverges from official Roman Catholic teaching. Many Catholics do in fact pray directly to saints and/or Mary, asking them for help – instead of asking the saints and/or Mary to intercede with God for help. Whatever the case, whether a saint or Mary is being prayed to, or asked to pray, neither practice has any Biblical basis.

The Bible nowhere instructs believers in Christ to pray to anyone other than God. The Bible nowhere encourages, or even mentions, believers asking individuals in Heaven for their prayers. Why, then, do many Catholic pray to Mary and/or the saints, or request their prayers? Catholics view Mary and saints as "intercessors" before God. They believe that a saint, who is glorified in Heaven, has more "direct access" to God than we do. Therefore, if a saint delivers a prayer to God, it is more effective than us praying to God directly. This concept is blatantly unbiblical. Hebrews 4:16 tells us that we, believers here on earth, can "...approach the throne of grace with confidence..."

1 Timothy 2:5 declares, "For there is one God and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus." There is no one else that can mediate with God for us. If Jesus is the ONLY mediator, that indicates Mary and saints cannot be mediators. They cannot mediate our prayer requests to God. Further, the Bible tells us that Jesus Christ Himself is interceding for us before the Father, "Therefore He is able to save completely those who come to God through Him, because He always lives to intercede for them" (Hebrews 7:25). With Jesus Himself interceding for us, why would we need Mary or the saints to intercede for us? Who would God listen to more closely than His Son? Romans 8:26-27 describes the Holy Spirit interceding for us. With the 2nd and 3rd members of the Trinity already interceding for us before the Father in Heaven, what possible need could there be to have Mary or the saints interceding for us?

Tony Bartolucci: Drowning in the Tiber--Part 8 and 9 are up

Part 8 and 9 of Pastor Tony Bartolucci's sermon series Drowning in the Tiber are up and ready to download. I'll be listening ASAP!

The Sabbath Rest: Part Two

After I wrote 'The Sabbath Rest' post, I remembered that my husband had written a sermon series a while back about the ten commandments, which of course included one about the sabbath. I went back and read it, and it fit exactly what I was trying to hint at in the first post. Following are a few exerpts from the sermon, but please follow the link to read the entire message.
First my husband talks about the commandments in general:

In our New Testament age, the real application of these commands belongs to the church. Sometimes Christians get confused when they remove the New Testament foundation from their understanding of these commandments and try to put themselves under the Old Testament law. The cross of Jesus Christ is the lens by which everything in the scripture must be viewed. We cannot go back and try to put our lives under the Old Testament law, but we must submit ourselves to the New Testament commandments that are applied through the law of faith. Jesus said that He did not come to do away with the law but to fulfill the law and then offer Himself as a redemptive sacrifice for us. This Bible, Christianity, encouragement, Jesus, justification, salvation, Sufficiency of Christ, The Gospelis affirmed and explained in Romans 3:

23 for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, 24 being justified freely by His grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus, 25 whom God set forth as a propitiation by His blood, through faith, to demonstrate His righteousness, because in His forbearance God had passed over the sins that were previously committed, 26 to demonstrate at the present time His righteousness, that He might be just and the justifier of the one who has faith in Jesus. 27 Where is boasting then? It is excluded. By what law? Of works? No, but by the law of faith. 28 Therefore we conclude that a man is justified by faith apart from the deeds of the law. 29 Or is He the God of the Jews only? Is He not also the God of the Gentiles? Yes, of the Gentiles also, 30 since there is one God who will justify the circumcised by faith and the uncircumcised through faith. 31 Do we then make void the law through faith? Certainly not! On the contrary, we establish the law.

After explaining more about this, he goes on to speak specifically about the sabbath:

Since we are looking at the Ten Commandments through the light of the New Testament and the lens of the cross, I decided that the Sabbath should be the first point of study. The reason being is that this is the most misunderstood commandment by Christians and it also points God’s people directly to Jesus Christ. Since Jesus is the focal point by which we view the Old Testament and all commandments, it only makes sense to begin from this point.



The Sabbath is not Sunday. The Sabbath is the seventh day of the week which is Saturday. In the beginning, God created the heavens, the earth, and all that is in them in six days and on the seventh day He rested. God rested in order to provide an example for God’s people to follow His example and to rest on the Sabbath. This principle also points to a deeper spiritual understanding as we will soon explore. Many who oppose the concept of Sunday worship such as the Seventh Day Adventist frequently challenge all the other denominations to prove that the Sabbath was changed. One leader in this denomination offered $64,000 for anyone who can prove biblically that the Sabbath was changed to Sunday in the scriptures.



Don’t waste your time with this challenge for you will not find anything in the Bible where God changed the day in which we celebrate the Sabbath. The problem is that the question is flawed.

After explaining the concept of the sabbath, my husband goes on to the most important part of the message, which speaks of the meaning of the sabbath rest, and how it is fulfilled in Jesus Christ.

Jesus made a point of shaking up the religious leader’s view of the Sabbath. If you read through the gospels, take note of the number of times Jesus blatantly violated the Sabbath in the sight of the Pharisees. As you do, keep in mind that the Pharisees were not condemned for questioning Jesus’ breaking of the Sabbath, they were condemned for rejecting Jesus. A little earlier I noted that the command to keep the Sabbath pointed to a deeper spiritual principle. Jesus broke the traditional view of the Sabbath in order to draw attention to the spiritual meaning of the Sabbath. He constantly proclaimed that He was Lord of the Sabbath and that the Sabbath was meant for man. Man wasn’t created for the Sabbath, but the Sabbath was created for man (Mark 2:27). As we examine this law, keep in mind the teaching of Galatians 3:24-25

24 Therefore the law was our tutor to bring us to Christ, that we might be justified by faith. 25 But after faith has come, we are no longer under a tutor.



The law of the Sabbath pointed to what was fulfilled in Christ. In the Old Testament, breaking the Sabbath was punishable by death. Look at Exodus 31:14-15

14 'You shall keep the Sabbath, therefore, for it is holy to you. Everyone who profanes it shall surely be put to death; for whoever does any work on it, that person shall be cut off from among his people. 15 'Work shall be done for six days, but the seventh is the Sabbath of rest, holy to the LORD. Whoever does any work on the Sabbath day, he shall surely be put to death.



Not all the commandments carried a death penalty; so why did God put such importance on the Sabbath that any who broke it would pay with their life? To understand the reason we must understand the meaning behind the Sabbath which could not have been known before Christ revealed the covenant of the New Testament to the church. The above scripture also helps us to understand why the Jews had such a hard time accepting Jesus’ breaking of the Sabbath. Any work was punishable by death regardless of how miniscule it was, but when Jesus came, He intentionally broke the Sabbath for the purpose of bringing attention to His Lordship and the principle of the Sabbath.

What is that principle which is so essential that if we do not obey it, the end is death?

If Jesus was indeed the Lord of the Sabbath, then He had to have a reason for breaking the Sabbath and teaching His disciples to do so. In the Old Testament, God clearly instructed people not to gather food on the Sabbath and someone found picking up sticks for firewood was executed for breaking the Sabbath. Now Jesus and His disciples are walking through a field and gathering food on the Sabbath in the sight of all. When questioned, Jesus says that the Sabbath is made for man and not man for the Sabbath and then claims that He has the right to do what He is doing because He is also the Lord of the Sabbath. Jesus is making the claim that not only does He have the right to rule the Sabbath, but He is also changing the way mankind views the Sabbath.



The law of keeping the Sabbath clearly served a purpose that God reinforced with severe judgment, but as revealed by Jesus, the Sabbath was a tutor for a greater principle that was now being revealed by His ministry on earth. The Sabbath is the rest given by God and the promise to God’s people. Through the law, God taught His people to understand the promise but God did not permit God’s people to inherit the promise by the law. When God led the people to the Promised Land, He required faith before they could inherit the promise. Without faith, God delivered the people out of the bondage of Pharaoh; without faith God led them through the wilderness; without faith God defeated all enemies, gave them manna, water from the rock and showed the children of Israel many mighty works. However, when the time came to inherit the promise, God required faith.



God sent twelve spies into the land – one from each tribe. He did this to test God’s people. They spied out the land and brought a discouraging report to the people. The land was just as God promised, but the inhabitants were strong and could not be defeated. Even though God defeated everyone that challenged Israel and even humbled Pharaoh, the children of Israel still had no faith and rebelled against the Lord. It was not the law that prevented them from inheriting the promise, but unbelief. Keeping the law meant nothing if faith was absent. Look at Hebrews 3:

17 Now with whom was He angry forty years? Was it not with those who sinned, whose corpses fell in the wilderness? 18 And to whom did He swear that they would not enter His rest, but to those who did not obey? 19 So we see that they could not enter in because of unbelief.

Hebrews 4:1 Therefore, since a promise remains of entering His rest, let us fear lest any of you seem to have come short of it. 2 For indeed the gospel was preached to us as well as to them; but the word which they heard did not profit them, not being mixed with faith in those who heard it. 3 For we who have believed do enter that rest, as He has said: "So I swore in My wrath, 'They shall not enter My rest,' " although the works were finished from the foundation of the world. 4 For He has spoken in a certain place of the seventh day in this way: "And God rested on the seventh day from all His works"; 5 and again in this place: "They shall not enter My rest." 6 Since therefore it remains that some must enter it, and those to whom it was first preached did not enter because of disobedience, 7 again He designates a certain day, saying in David, "Today," after such a long time, as it has been said: "Today, if you will hear His voice, Do not harden your hearts." 8 For if Joshua had given them rest, then He would not afterward have spoken of another day. 9 There remains therefore a rest for the people of God. 10 For he who has entered His rest has himself also ceased from his works as God did from His. 11 Let us therefore be diligent to enter that rest, lest anyone fall according to the same example of disobedience.



This passage of scripture is where the rubber meets the road. This scripture clearly makes a connection between God’s example of rest on the seventh day, the Promised Land of the children of Israel and the rest provided through Christ as it ties them together as being all a part of the same principle. Notice that God speaks of the ‘rest’ of God’s people as the ‘rest’ of the Sabbath. This passage in Hebrews provides an important key to understanding the command to keep the Sabbath for it links the rest of the promise of God with the rest of the Sabbath. God used the example of Israel to teach us the principle of our promise of salvation. Jesus is the Lord of the Sabbath because He is Lord of our salvation. We enter the rest of the Lord through the cross of Jesus Christ for He alone leads us into the promise.

Please read the entire message to see all the points my husband brings out.
Jesus performed many miraculous healings on the sabbath. I again submit that, for those with eyes to see and ears to hear His word, this is a clear message that our healing is accomplished by Him on a day of rest and not on a day of works. He is our Sabbath Rest, by faith and not by works.

Hebrews 4

1 Therefore, since a promise remains of entering His rest, let us fear lest any of you seem to have come short of it. 2 For indeed the gospel was preached to us as well as to them; but the word which they heard did not profit them, not being mixed with faith in those who heard it. 3 For we who have believed do enter that rest, as He has said:

“ So I swore in My wrath,

‘ They shall not enter My rest,’”

although the works were finished from the foundation of the world. 4 For He has spoken in a certain place of the seventh day in this way: “And God rested on the seventh day from all His works”; 5 and again in this place: “They shall not enter My rest.”
6 Since therefore it remains that some must enter it, and those to whom it was first preached did not enter because of disobedience, 7 again He designates a certain day, saying in David, “Today,” after such a long time, as it has been said:


“ Today, if you will hear His voice,
Do not harden your hearts.”

8 For if Joshua had given them rest, then He would not afterward have spoken of another day. 9 There remains therefore a rest for the people of God. 10 For he who has entered His rest has himself also ceased from his works as God did from His.

The Sabbath Rest

Why did Jesus so many times heal people on the sabbath? Was it simply to annoy the Jews, or was there some deeper reason?
I submit, after reading the story of Jesus healing the man born blind, in John 9, that He did it to show that our healing is done on a day of rest (faith) and not a day of works.

William Webster: How Rome Defines Saving faith

We've been having a discussion here about whether Rome teaches salvation by works (merit) and while I take a break for the weekend before investigating the Catechism of the Catholic Church, I wanted to give people the opportunity to read these two articles by William Webster. The first is his testimony called Did I Really Leave the Holy Catholic Church?
The second is his article called Saving Faith: How Does Rome Define It?

As these articles will show, IF the catechism does NOT teach justification by works (which I have not admitted, and I believe it has been shown before that it does)then there are other ways in which the Roman Catholic Church adds works to salvation, and subverts the true gospel of Christ, namely, by adding dogmas which must be believed for salvation, but which were never taught in scripture or believed by the early church.

Two false gospels: Daughters of Augustine--Part Three, a clarification

I had said I would talk some more about Augustine's influence on Calvin next, but I wanted to clarify something first. I have called the two belief systems, Roman Catholicism and Calvinism, that descend (in part) from Augustine 'false doctrines.' That does not mean, however that I believe everyone who is within these belief systems is not a true Christian. As far as Catholicism goes, I believe it is wholly false, yet some within it are saved. As for Calvinism, I know and know of many Calvinists who are true believers, and Calvinists are great defenders of salvation by grace alone through faith alone. Pastor Cloud has written of this in the article I linked to in the last post, 'The Calvinism Debate.' Following is an excerpt from the article, from the section called 'I do not treat all Calvinists the same.'

It is important to understand that there is a great variety of doctrine and practice among Calvinists, and by no means do I consider a man to be an enemy of the truth just because he accepts some of the Calvinist theology. The book Spurgeon vs. Hyper Calvinists: The Battle for Gospel Preaching by Iain Murray (Edinburgh, Banner of Truth Trust, 1995) does an excellent job of describing some of the differences among Calvinists. There are soul winning Calvinists, Calvinists with great evangelistic and missionary zeal; and there are Calvinists who condemn these things. Some interpret Calvinism in such a way that they do not believe in offering salvation to or preaching the gospel to all sinners; they do not even believe that God loves all men. According to Murray’s definition, these are “hyper Calvinists.”

Charles Spurgeon refused to try to reconcile every seeming contradiction in the Bible, and he was wise enough to know that he could not understand every mystery of God. He said:

“That God predestines, and that man is responsible, are two things that few can see. They are believed to be inconsistent and contradictory; but they are not. It is just the fault of our weak judgment. Two truths cannot be contradictory to each other. If, then, I find taught in one place that everything is fore-ordained, that is true; and if I find in another place that man is responsible for all his actions, that is true; and it is my folly that leads me to imagine that two truths can ever contradict each other. These two truths, I do not believe, can ever be welded into one upon any human anvil, but one they shall be in eternity: they are two lines that are so nearly parallel, that the mind that shall pursue them farthest, will never discover that they converge; but they do converge, and they will meet somewhere in eternity, close to the throne of God, whence all truth doth spring” (C.H. Spurgeon, New Park Street Pulpit, Vol. 4, 1858, p. 337).

Spurgeon warned about creating theologies that attempt to reconcile every biblical difficulty:

“Men who are morbidly anxious to possess a self-consistent creed, a creed which will put together and form a square like a Chinese puzzle,--are very apt to narrow their souls. Those who will only believe what they can reconcile will necessarily disbelieve much of divine revelation. Those who receive by faith anything which they find in the Bible will receive two things, twenty things, ay, or twenty thousand things, though they cannot construct a theory which harmonises them all” (C.H. Spurgeon, “Faith,” Sword and Trowel, 1872).

In these matters, Charles Spurgeon was a Calvinist but he was much more than a Calvinist; he was a Biblicist. It has been said of Spurgeon, that if you pricked him, even his blood was “bibline.” He loved theology and studied theology earnestly, but the bottom line was that he had childlike faith in everything the Bible says.

And while Spurgeon was a Calvinist, he was at the same time a great evangelist and believed in offering the gospel to all men and urging all men to be saved. Spurgeon believed that more sinners could be saved if the gospel was preached to them, and he did not try to reconcile such a view with God’s election. He believed his responsibility was to preach the gospel to as many sinners as possible. He believed that tools such as prayer could result in a greater harvest of souls. He had prayer meetings before the preaching services and every Monday night and on other occasions. Sometimes when the auditorium of the Metropolitan Tabernacle was full, a group would remain in the downstairs prayer hall and pray during the preaching (as per an e-mail from Mrs. Hannah Wyncoll, Administrative Assistant, Metropolitan Tabernacle, June 2, 2000). Spurgeon loved soul winning and taught his people to be soul winners. His famous book The Soul Winner is still in print. There were some in Spurgeon’s church who “made it their special work to ‘watch for souls’ in our great congregation, and to seek to bring to immediate decision those who appeared to be impressed under the preaching of the Word. [Bro. Cloud: Note the word ‘decision’ in Spurgeon’s description of this soul winner!] One brother has earned for himself the title of my hunting dog, for he is always ready to pick up the wounded birds. One Monday night, at the prayer-meeting, he was sitting near me on the platform; all at once I missed him, and presently I saw him right at the other end of the building. After the meeting, I asked why he went off so suddenly, and he said that the gas just shone on the face of a woman in the congregation, and she looked so sad that he walked round, and sat near her, in readiness to speak to her about the Saviour after the service” (C.H. Spurgeon, The Full Harvest, p. 76). Thus we see that Charles Spurgeon was a man who was very zealous for the winning of souls, and his Calvinism and his convictions about the sovereignty of God in no wise hindered that.

On the other hand, many Calvinists of that day opposed Spurgeon vehemently from their pulpits and in their magazines and denounced his practice of giving invitations for sinners to come to Christ. (He did not have the people actually come forward during the church service as is commonly practiced today, but he invited them to come to Christ all the same; and he believed that a sinner was saved in every seat in the Metropolitan Tabernacle’s massive auditorium of that day.)

For example, one popular Calvinist paper of Spurgeon’s day was the Earthen Vessel. In one of its issues in 1857, it boldly stated that “to preach that it is man’s duty to believe savingly in Christ is ABSURD.” Well, that was exactly what Spurgeon preached, so to a great many Calvinists of his day, Spurgeon was an absurd fellow!

This reminds us that there are different kinds of Calvinists and it is not wise to lump them all into the same mold.

I have had the privilege of knowing, and communicating at a distance with, many godly soul winning Calvinists. Though I am in strong disagreement with such men on the subject of Calvinist theology, I do not consider them enemies.

Next time I would like to talk about Augustine, and discuss the perspective I have already given, plus another perspective I have just found that sees him as, not only a great defender against heresies, but because he was a man always learning and growing, his voluminous writings have inspired two opposing systems: Roman Catholicism and the Reformation doctrines of grace.

Two false gospels: Daughters of Augustine--Part Two

Pastor David Cloud of Way of Life Literature has several good articles about Calvinism in his topical database. One if these is called The Calvinism Debate; it was very helpful to me in understanding Calvinism and comparing it to scripture. One of the sections that was helpful was called 'Some central errors of Calvinism. Number 7 of this section was called 'CALVINISM GOES BACK TO THE “CHURCH FATHERS” FOR AUTHORITY INSTEAD OF STRICTLY TO THE NEW TESTAMENT APOSTLES AND PROPHETS' and stresses that Calvin was very dependent upon Augustine for his doctrines and philosophies. St. Augustine is also a major founder of much Catholic doctrine. Following is section 7:

Calvin freely acknowledged that his authority was Augustine. Consider the following quotes:

“If I were inclined to compile a whole volume from Augustine, I could easily show my readers, that I need no words but his” (Institutes, Book III, chap. 22).

“Let Augustine answer for me…” (Ibid.).

“[Augustine is the one] we quote most frequently as being the best and most faithful witness of all antiquity” (Institutes, Book IV, chap. 14).

“Augustine is so wholly with me, that if I wished to write a confession of my faith, I could do so ... out of his writings” (Calvin, “A Treatise on the Eternal Predestination of God,” trans. by Henry Cole, Calvin’s Calvinism, Grandville, MI: Reformed Free Publishing, 1987, p. 38; cited in Laurence Vance, The Other Side of Calvinism, 1999, p. 38).

WHO WAS AUGUSTINE? He was so polluted with heresy that the Roman Catholic Church has claimed him as one of its “doctors.”

Augustine was a persecutor and the father of the doctrine of persecution in the Catholic Church. The historian Neander observed that Augustine’s teaching “contains the germ of the whole system of spiritual despotism, intolerance, and persecution, even to the court of the Inquisition.” He instigated bitter persecutions against the Bible-believing Donatists who were striving to maintain pure churches after the apostolic faith.

Augustine was the father of amillennialism, interpreting Bible prophecy allegorically; teaching that the Catholic Church is the kingdom of God.

Augustine taught that Mary did not commit sin.

Augustine believed in purgatory.

Augustine was one of the fathers of the heresy of infant baptism, claiming that unbaptized infants were lost, and calling all who rejected infant baptism “infidels” and “cursed.”

Augustine exalted church tradition above the Bible and said, “I should not believe the gospel unless I were moved to do so by the authority of the Catholic Church.”

A great danger of christians following the doctrines of one man, such as Calvin, and Augustine before him, is that people become dependent upon those doctrines as systematized or 'crystalized' by that one man instead of seeking God directly in His word and letting the Holy Spirit teach us. This doesn't mean it's not good to be taught by godly men; of course it is; but we are responsible to compare everything to scripture and God promises He will teach us if we seek Him diligently in His word.
I'd like to look more at what Calvin taught as he received it from Augustine next time I post, if possible.

Answers in Genesis: Study shows many populations descended from only three genetic groups: Shem, Ham, and Japeth? Not a surprise to bible-believers

Answers in Genesis posted a newsletter article entitled “Among Many Peoples, Little Genomic Variety” which links to a Washington Post article about a study on this subject. The results of the study are no surprise to those who hold to the literal truth of God's word in the creation story in Genesis. Following is the Answers in Genesis article:

A new genetic study of 53 human populations shows that each falls into one of three genetic groups—yet that the three groups aren’t as different as was thought. The legacy of Shem, Ham, and Japheth (Noah’s three sons), perhaps?

Washington Post writer David Brown reviews a recent study that analyzes genetic information from 53 human groups, comparing and contrasting what makes us human.

Generally speaking, all people groups seem to fall into “just three” categories, Brown reports. According to evolutionists, this tripartite division originated when humans left Africa tens of thousands of years ago, splitting into African, Eurasian, and East Asian groups (the third of which includes Pacific Islander and Native American groups).

For creationists, that division makes plain sense as reflective of the people groups that split off after Babel, all descendants of Shem, Ham, and Japheth. Of course, in the millennia since, those people groups have migrated and interbred, so it’s difficult to say perfectly what modern groups belong to what ancestor—or even to imply that the ordinary human descends from just one of Noah’s three sons/daughters-in-law. Additionally, the genomes have been influenced over the years by environment. So a population of Shem’s descendants and a population of Japheth’s descendants living in the same environment for millennia would come to resemble one another. Brown makes the point, albeit from an evolutionary perspective:

People adapted to what they encountered the way all living organisms do: through natural selection. A small fraction of the mutations constantly creeping into our genes happened by chance to prove beneficial in the new circumstances outside the African homeland. Those included differences in climate, altitude, latitude, food availability, parasites, infectious diseases, and lots of other things.

Nonetheless, the study is an exciting reminder of the reality of the Genesis account.

But what else is interesting is that the three broad groupings in the study aren’t as different as evolutionists expected. Brown writes, “Scientists have long known that regardless of ancestral home or ethnic group, everyone’s genes are pretty much alike. We’re all Homo sapiens. Everything else is pretty much details.” Brown identifies skin color as the “most obvious” of these details. Of course, that reflects what creationists have emphasized, but differs from what some evolutionists originally preached (see Darwin’s Plantation for more). He goes on, “Population geneticists expected to find dramatic differences . . . [but] that’s not what scientists have found. Dramatic genome variation among populations turns out to be extremely rare.”

The entire study reminds us of how the variation we see among human populations today could have arisen as our forbears left Babel. Genetic drift and natural selection played important roles over time, which is why any two humans randomly selected may differ in stature, skin color, disease susceptibility, lactose tolerance, and so forth—even while all of us remain entirely and equally human. The Bible’s message in Acts 17:26—that we are all of one blood, descendants of Adam through Noah—is a powerful truth explaining our world.

Two false gospels: Daughters of Augustine, Part One

I've been looking into the doctrines of Calvinism off and on during this same time that I've also been studying Roman Catholicism, and today I again came across this statement about Calvinism here
by Pastor David Cloud of Way of Life Literature:

Thus, while I have not read every book on this subject that could be recommended by my readers, I have made a considerable effort to understand Calvinism properly and not to misrepresent it (though I have learned that a non-Calvinist will ALWAYS be charged with misrepresentation).

The Calvinist will doubtless argue that I simply don’t understand Calvinism properly, and to this I reply that if Calvinism is that complicated it can’t be the truth. If a reasonably intelligent preacher who has studied and taught the Bible diligently for 32 years and has published a Bible encyclopedia and many other Bible study books can study Calvinism with a desire to understand it properly and still not understand it, then it is far too complicated to be the truth! The apostle Paul warned that it is the devil that makes theology that complicated. “But I fear, lest by any means, as the serpent beguiled Eve through his subtilty, so your minds should be corrupted from the simplicity that is in Christ” (2 Cor. 11:3). Of course, Calvinism is not simple by any means and this is one reason why it produces an elitist mentality. To understand Calvinism one must deal with compatibalism, monergism versus synergism, electing grace vs. irresistible grace, effectual calling vs. general calling, effective atonement vs. hypothetical atonement, libertarian free will vs. the bondage of the will, objective grace and subjective grace, natural ability and moral ability, mediate vs. immediate imputation of Adam’s sin, supralapsarianism, sublapsarianism, infralapsarianism, desiderative vs. decretive will, and antecedent hypothetical will, to name a few!

This statement reminded me of a statement I made to Elena (who is a Roman Catholic) about Roman Catholicism under the comment section on my post called 'Pastor Tony Bartolucci on Francis Beckwith: Drowning in the Tiber.' I had commented to Elena that I have been studying Roman Catholicism consistently for months, and on and off for several years, and she, apparently believing that Roman Catholicism is impossible to understand without years of study, or by those who do not adhere to it's tenets, said: " ooooo!! Months huh? Honey, you haven't even scratched the surface." My reply was:

That's arrogant, Elena. If it takes years to understand enough about the RCC to know whether or not it teaches the true gospel, then we are all hopeless, Elena. If the RCC teachings are so hard to understand that a normal person, a born again person like me, can't understand them when comparing them to scripture then the RCC teachings are definitely not the gospel, because the gospel is simple and concise. I don't need to study for twenty years and have an advanced degree in theology to be able to compare doctrines to scripture. All believers are told to do this, to beware of false teachings, and we all can do it in days or weeks if we prayerfully study with the help of the Spirit who teaches believers.

I have been coming to the conclusion that both Roman Catholicism and Calvinism are false doctrines, and both,coincidentally(?), descending at least in part from Augustine of Hippo.

Why Evangelicals are Returning to Rome: The Abandonment of Sola Scriptura as a Formal Principle-- By Bob DeWaay

Here is a message by Bob DeWaay on why evangelicals are returning to the Roman Catholic church. Following is the introduction to the message.

The February 2008 edition of Christianity Today ran a cover story about evangelicals looking to the ancient Roman Catholic Church in order to find beliefs and practices.1 What was shocking about the article was that both the author of the article and the senior managing editor of CT claim that this trip back to Rome is a good thing. Says Mark Galli the editor, “While the ancient church has captivated the evangelical imagination for some time, it hasn’t been until recently that it’s become an accepted fixture of the evangelical landscape. And this is for the good.”2 Chris Armstrong, the author of the article who promotes the trip back to the ancient church, claims that because the movement is led by such persons as “Dallas Willard, Richard Foster, and living and practicing monks and nuns,” that therefore, “they are receiving good guidance on this road from wise teachers.” This he claims shows that, “Christ is guiding the process.”3

Apparently, contemporary evangelicals have forgotten that sola scriptura (scripture alone) was the formal principle of the Reformation. Teachings and practices that could not be justified from Scripture were rejected on that principle. To endorse a trip back to these practices of ancient Roman Catholicism is to reject the principle of sola scriptura being the normative authority for the beliefs and practices of the church. In this article I will explore how modern evangelicalism has compromised the principle of sola scriptura and thus paved smoothly the road back to Rome.

Here is the conclusion to the message, but please go to the link above to read the entire article.

Perhaps the best antidote to rejecting sola scriptura and going back to Rome would be a careful study of the Book of Hebrews. It describes a situation that is analogous to that which evangelicals face today. The Hebrew Christians were considering going back to temple Judaism. Their reasons can be discerned by the admonitions and warnings in Hebrews. The key problem for them was the tangibility of the temple system, and the invisibility of the Christian faith. Just about everything that was offered to them by Christianity was invisible: the High Priest in heaven, the tabernacle in heaven, the once for all shed blood, and the throne of grace. At the end of Hebrews, the author of Hebrews points out that they have come to something better than mount Sinai: “But you have come to Mount Zion and to the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, and to myriads of angels, to the general assembly and church of the first-born who are enrolled in heaven, and to God, the Judge of all, and to the spirits of righteous men made perfect, and to Jesus, the mediator of a new covenant, and to the sprinkled blood, which speaks better than the blood of Abel” (Hebrews 12:22-24). All of these things are invisible.

But the life of faith does not require tangible visibility: “Now faith is the assurance of things hoped for, the conviction of things not seen” (Hebrews 11:1). The Roman Catholic Church has tangibility that is unmatched by the evangelical faith, just as temple Judaism had. Why have faith in the once-for-all shed blood of Christ that is unseen when you can have real blood (that of the animals for temple Judaism and the Eucharistic Christ of Catholicism)? Why have the scriptures of the Biblical apostles and prophets who are now in heaven when you can have a real, live apostle and his teaching Magisterium who can continue to speak for God? The similarities to the situation described in Hebrews are striking. Why have only the Scriptures and the other means of grace when the Roman Church has everything from icons to relics to cathedrals to holy water and so many other tangible religious articles and experiences?

I urge my fellow evangelicals to seriously consider the consequences of rejecting sola scriptura as the formal principle of our theology. If my Hebrews analogy is correct, such a rejection is tantamount to apostasy.

The Prophetic Calling of Every Believer by Bob DeWaay

In this article by Pastor Bob DeWaay, he teaches about the prophetic authority given to each believer by the Holy Spirit to speak God's word from the scriptures. Following is an excerpt from the message. Please go to the link to read the entire article.

“Do not quench the Spirit; do not despise prophetic utterances. But examine everything carefully; hold fast to that which is good; abstain from every form of evil.” (1Thessalonians 5:19-22)

Paul instructs us to take prophetic utterances seriously. To “despise” means to treat with “dismissive disdain.”1 In 1Corinthians 14:31, Paul wrote, “For you can all prophesy one by one, so that all may learn and all may be exhorted.” He spoke, not about utterances of official authoritative prophets, but about prophetic utterances that could be given by any member of the congregation.

Today many are confused about the meaning of the term “prophecy” as it was used in the 1st century church, and what, if anything, it is in the church today. Some assume that prophesies were spontaneous, “ecstatic utterances” caused by the Holy Spirit. Some, who hold this view, believe that these utterances have ceased. Others hold the same view, but believe that these ecstatic utterances are also for the church today. Still others believe that prophecy in the first century was the Holy Spirit giving inspired revelation that was necessary to fill in the gap caused by the incomplete canon of the New Testament. Those who hold this latter view generally say that all prophecy has ceased.2

Here is what I believe: that prophecy, as addressed by the passages above, is to proclaim valid implications and applications of authoritative Scripture. Under the New Covenant, every redeemed child of God has the Holy Spirit, and therefore may prophesy. This is an implication of Peter's citation of Joel in Acts 2:17—rather than the Holy Spirit only coming upon certain persons as under the Old Covenant, He indwells every true New Covenant believer. This is why they “may all prophesy” as Paul wrote.

The Trinity in the New Testament

Matthew 3:16-17 (New King James Version)
16 When He had been baptized, Jesus came up immediately from the water; and behold, the heavens were opened to Him, and He saw the Spirit of God descending like a dove and alighting upon Him. 17 And suddenly a voice came from heaven, saying, “This is My beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased.”

Luke 11:13 (New King James Version)
13 If you then, being evil, know how to give good gifts to your children, how much more will your heavenly Father give the Holy Spirit to those who ask Him!”

John 14:26 (New King James Version)
26 But the Helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in My name, He will teach you all things, and bring to your remembrance all things that I said to you.

John 15:26 (New King James Version)
26 “But when the Helper comes, whom I shall send to you from the Father, the Spirit of truth who proceeds from the Father, He will testify of Me.

Luke 10:21 (New King James Version)
21 In that hour Jesus rejoiced in the Spirit and said, “I thank You, Father, Lord of heaven and earth, that You have hidden these things from the wise and prudent and revealed them to babes. Even so, Father, for so it seemed good in Your sight.

Matthew 28:18-20 (New King James Version)
18 And Jesus came and spoke to them, saying, “All authority has been given to Me in heaven and on earth. 19 Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, 20 teaching them to observe all things that I have commanded you; and lo, I am with you always, even to the end of the age.” Amen.

Acts 1:4-5 (New King James Version)
4 And being assembled together with them, He commanded them not to depart from Jerusalem, but to wait for the Promise of the Father, “which,” He said, “you have heard from Me; 5 for John truly baptized with water, but you shall be baptized with the Holy Spirit not many days from now.”

Acts 2:32-33 (New King James Version)
32 This Jesus God has raised up, of which we are all witnesses. 33 Therefore being exalted to the right hand of God, and having received from the Father the promise of the Holy Spirit, He poured out this which you now see and hear.

Romans 8:14-17 (New King James Version)
14 For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, these are sons of God. 15 For you did not receive the spirit of bondage again to fear, but you received the Spirit of adoption by whom we cry out, “Abba, Father.” 16 The Spirit Himself bears witness with our spirit that we are children of God, 17 and if children, then heirs—heirs of God and joint heirs with Christ, if indeed we suffer with Him, that we may also be glorified together.

Galatians 4:4-7 (New King James Version)
4 But when the fullness of the time had come, God sent forth His Son, born of a woman, born under the law, 5 to redeem those who were under the law, that we might receive the adoption as sons.
6 And because you are sons, God has sent forth the Spirit of His Son into your hearts, crying out, “Abba, Father!” 7 Therefore you are no longer a slave but a son, and if a son, then an heir of God through Christ.

Ephesians 1:3-14 (New King James Version)
3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who has blessed us with every spiritual blessing in the heavenly places in Christ, 4 just as He chose us in Him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before Him in love, 5 having predestined us to adoption as sons by Jesus Christ to Himself, according to the good pleasure of His will, 6 to the praise of the glory of His grace, by which He made us accepted in the Beloved.
7 In Him we have redemption through His blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of His grace 8 which He made to abound toward us in all wisdom and prudence, 9 having made known to us the mystery of His will, according to His good pleasure which He purposed in Himself, 10 that in the dispensation of the fullness of the times He might gather together in one all things in Christ, both[a] which are in heaven and which are on earth—in Him. 11 In Him also we have obtained an inheritance, being predestined according to the purpose of Him who works all things according to the counsel of His will, 12 that we who first trusted in Christ should be to the praise of His glory.
13 In Him you also trusted, after you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation; in whom also, having believed, you were sealed with the Holy Spirit of promise, 14 who[b] is the guarantee of our inheritance until the redemption of the purchased possession, to the praise of His glory.

Ephesians 2:13-18 (New King James Version)
13 But now in Christ Jesus you who once were far off have been brought near by the blood of Christ.
14 For He Himself is our peace, who has made both one, and has broken down the middle wall of separation, 15 having abolished in His flesh the enmity, that is, the law of commandments contained in ordinances, so as to create in Himself one new man from the two, thus making peace, 16 and that He might reconcile them both to God in one body through the cross, thereby putting to death the enmity. 17 And He came and preached peace to you who were afar off and to those who were near. 18 For through Him we both have access by one Spirit to the Father.

1 Peter 1:1-2
1 Peter, an apostle of Jesus Christ,

To the pilgrims of the Dispersion in Pontus, Galatia, Cappadocia, Asia, and Bithynia, 2 elect according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, in sanctification of the Spirit, for obedience and sprinkling of the blood of Jesus Christ:

Grace to you and peace be multiplied.

1 John 5:7 (New King James Version)
7 For there are three that bear witness in heaven: the Father, the Word, and the Holy Spirit; and these three are one.

Revelation 3:20-22 (New King James Version)
20 Behold, I stand at the door and knock. If anyone hears My voice and opens the door, I will come in to him and dine with him, and he with Me. 21 To him who overcomes I will grant to sit with Me on My throne, as I also overcame and sat down with My Father on His throne.
22 “He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches.”’”

Revelation 5:6 (New King James Version)
6 And I looked, and behold, in the midst of the throne and of the four living creatures, and in the midst of the elders, stood a Lamb as though it had been slain, having seven horns and seven eyes, which are the seven Spirits of God sent out into all the earth.

Revelation 21:9-11 (New King James Version)
9 Then one of the seven angels who had the seven bowls filled with the seven last plagues came to me and talked with me, saying, “Come, I will show you the bride, the Lamb’s wife.” 10 And he carried me away in the Spirit to a great and high mountain, and showed me the great city, the holy Jerusalem, descending out of heaven from God, 11 having the glory of God. Her light was like a most precious stone, like a jasper stone, clear as crystal.

"Behold, I lay in Zion a Stumbling Stone"

In Romans 9:33 (See the Romans passages below) Paul quotes from Old Testament scripture in Isaiah (see the two passages just below) to show the church in Rome that Jesus the Cornerstone becomes a stumbling stone to those who, like Israel, try to pursue righteousness by works of the law, even God's law, instead of seeking it by faith. In Romans 10:3-4 Paul elaborates, saying that those who seek to establish their own righteousness by works have not submitted to the righteousness of God which comes by faith, 'For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to everyone who believes.' In Romans 11:5-6 Paul goes on to say that the remnant of the elect is saved by grace and not of works, 'otherwise grace is no longer grace,' meaning that if we try to be saved by works, then we have pushed the grace of God out of the picture. In Romans 11:7-8 (see below) Paul states that the elect, saved by grace through faith, have obtained righteousness, but those who sought to obtain it by their own works (even works of God's law) did not obtain it and were blinded: "God has given them a spirit of stupor,
Eyes that they should not see
And ears that they should not hear,
To this very day."
Paul further quotes from Psalm 69:22-23:
“ Let their table become a snare and a trap,
A stumbling block and a recompense to them.
10 Let their eyes be darkened, so that they do not see,
And bow down their back always.”
This passage from the Psalm is prophetic, speaking of the Jews who crucified Christ and persecuted and killed the prophets before Him and the Christians after Him, because the Jews could not understand and accept God's word; they thought their own righteousness upheld them as God's chosen people, but it was God's hand and His righteousness. Therefore the table of fellowship which they think they share and the 'well-being' they think they have has become a snare and a trap to them, and they are blind to the fact that they are enslaved to sin.
See Romans 4:1-8 which tells us that Abraham was justified not by works but by faith which was imputed to him for righteousness. It says "to him who works, the wages are not counted as grace but as debt.
5 But to him who does not work but believes on Him who justifies the ungodly, his faith is accounted for righteousness." This shows that trying to merit salvation by good works counts as a debt against us, but when we believe on Christ then His righteousness is imputed to our account.
In verses 13-15 of Romans 4, Paul says that salvation is through the promise of God by faith and NOT through works of the law, because 'the law brings about wrath' since all the law can do is show us that we cannot keep it. In verse 16 it says 'it is of faith that it might be according to grace' so that the promise of God 'might be sure to all the seed' including the gentiles who believe the promise by faith.
In verses 20-25 Paul teaches that Abraham didn't 'waver in unbelief' but was 'fully convinced that what He had promised He was also able to perform' and 'therefore “it was accounted to him for righteousness."' Paul finishes "It shall be imputed to us who believe in Him who raised up Jesus our Lord from the dead, who was delivered up because of our offenses, and was raised because of our justification." This shows again that righteousness will be imputed to those who by faith believe in God because of Christ's sacrifice for our sins; this is how we are justified or made right with God.
We stumble over the stumbling stone when we try to justify ourselves before God by good works instead of believing God's word by faith and being washed and regenerated by the Holy Spirit. First we are justified by faith, and then good works come into play for reborn believers as we abide in Christ and walk in the Spirit. We are new creatures with a new desire to please God. We begin to become more like Christ as we abide in His word and are sanctified by the Spirit that lives in us. We are first saved by grace and then we continue to walk in faith by His grace, not by our own power. See Titus 3:4-8a and Galatians 3:3-7
Titus 3:4-8a
4 But when the kindness and the love of God our Savior toward man appeared, 5 not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to His mercy He saved us, through the washing of regeneration and renewing of the Holy Spirit, 6 whom He poured out on us abundantly through Jesus Christ our Savior, 7 that having been justified by His grace we should become heirs according to the hope of eternal life.
8 This is a faithful saying, and these things I want you to affirm constantly, that those who have believed in God should be careful to maintain good works.
Galatians 3
3 Are you so foolish? Having begun in the Spirit, are you now being made perfect by the flesh? 4 Have you suffered so many things in vain—if indeed it was in vain?
5 Therefore He who supplies the Spirit to you and works miracles among you, does He do it by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith?— 6 just as Abraham “believed God, and it was accounted to him for righteousness.” 7 Therefore know that only those who are of faith are sons of Abraham.

ALL THESE PASSAGES BELOW ARE QUOTED IN THE POST ABOVE
Isaiah 8:14 (New King James Version)
14 He will be as a sanctuary,
But a stone of stumbling and a rock of offense
To both the houses of Israel,
As a trap and a snare to the inhabitants of Jerusalem.

Isaiah 28:16 (New King James Version)
16 Therefore thus says the Lord GOD:


“ Behold, I lay in Zion a stone for a foundation,
A tried stone, a precious cornerstone, a sure foundation;
Whoever believes will not act hastily.

Romans 9:
30 What shall we say then? That Gentiles, who did not pursue righteousness, have attained to righteousness, even the righteousness of faith; 31 but Israel, pursuing the law of righteousness, has not attained to the law of righteousness. 32 Why? Because they did not seek it by faith, but as it were, by the works of the law. For they stumbled at that stumbling stone. 33 As it is written:


“ Behold, I lay in Zion a stumbling stone and rock of offense,
And whoever believes on Him will not be put to shame.”

Romans 10:
1 Brethren, my heart’s desire and prayer to God for Israel is that they may be saved. 2 For I bear them witness that they have a zeal for God, but not according to knowledge. 3 For they being ignorant of God’s righteousness, and seeking to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted to the righteousness of God. 4 For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to everyone who believes.

Romans 11:
2 God has not cast away His people whom He foreknew. Or do you not know what the Scripture says of Elijah, how he pleads with God against Israel, saying, 3 “LORD, they have killed Your prophets and torn down Your altars, and I alone am left, and they seek my life”? 4 But what does the divine response say to him? “I have reserved for Myself seven thousand men who have not bowed the knee to Baal.” 5 Even so then, at this present time there is a remnant according to the election of grace. 6 And if by grace, then it is no longer of works; otherwise grace is no longer grace. But if it is of works, it is no longer grace; otherwise work is no longer work.
7 What then? Israel has not obtained what it seeks; but the elect have obtained it, and the rest were blinded. 8 Just as it is written:


“ God has given them a spirit of stupor,
Eyes that they should not see
And ears that they should not hear,
To this very day.”

9 And David says:


“ Let their table become a snare and a trap,
A stumbling block and a recompense to them.
10 Let their eyes be darkened, so that they do not see,
And bow down their back always.”


Romans 4:1-8 and 13-25
1 What then shall we say that Abraham our father has found according to the flesh? 2 For if Abraham was justified by works, he has something to boast about, but not before God. 3 For what does the Scripture say? “Abraham believed God, and it was accounted to him for righteousness.” 4 Now to him who works, the wages are not counted as grace but as debt.

5 But to him who does not work but believes on Him who justifies the ungodly, his faith is accounted for righteousness, 6 just as David also describes the blessedness of the man to whom God imputes righteousness apart from works:
7 “ Blessed are those whose lawless deeds are forgiven,
And whose sins are covered;
8 Blessed is the man to whom the LORD shall not impute sin.”

13 For the promise that he would be the heir of the world was not to Abraham or to his seed through the law, but through the righteousness of faith. 14 For if those who are of the law are heirs, faith is made void and the promise made of no effect, 15 because the law brings about wrath; for where there is no law there is no transgression.
16 Therefore it is of faith that it might be according to grace, so that the promise might be sure to all the seed, not only to those who are of the law, but also to those who are of the faith of Abraham, who is the father of us all 17 (as it is written, “I have made you a father of many nations”) in the presence of Him whom he believed—God, who gives life to the dead and calls those things which do not exist as though they did; 18 who, contrary to hope, in hope believed, so that he became the father of many nations, according to what was spoken, “So shall your descendants be.” 19 And not being weak in faith, he did not consider his own body, already dead (since he was about a hundred years old), and the deadness of Sarah’s womb. 20 He did not waver at the promise of God through unbelief, but was strengthened in faith, giving glory to God, 21 and being fully convinced that what He had promised He was also able to perform. 22 And therefore “it was accounted to him for righteousness.”
23 Now it was not written for his sake alone that it was imputed to him, 24 but also for us. It shall be imputed to us who believe in Him who raised up Jesus our Lord from the dead, 25 who was delivered up because of our offenses, and was raised because of our justification.

Already Gone: A new book by Ken Ham of Answers In Genesis

Ken Ham of Answers in Genesis has a new book out called Already Gone, which sounds a warning that evangelical churches are losing the next generation because the churches have failed to uphold the truth of scripture, especially the foundational truths of our origin as taught in Genesis. A newsletter article entitled 'Here We Stand- We can Do No Other!' stresses the importance of this book.
Here is an excerpt from the article:

This month marks a milestone in the Answers in Genesis ministry. In the book Already Gone, you will learn about a major research study that we believe could help lead to a revolution—another reformation, if you will—for a desperately needed transformation of the church in America.

For years, we have been challenging the church to stand without compromise on the authority of God’s Word, beginning in Genesis. We have insisted that Christians should be like the Bereans in Acts 17:11: “They received the word with all readiness, and searched the Scriptures daily to find out whether these things were so.”

Similarly, we have been encouraging Christians to be like Martin Luther, who stood before the authorities of his day and insisted that we judge our beliefs against the absolute authority of the Word of God—regardless of what the majority might say (e.g., scientists of today who hold to evolution and millions of years).

In this newsletter and in my lectures over the years, I have insisted that Christians who compromise by accepting the idea of an earth supposedly millions of years old (or who are indifferent to whether or not that is even a problem) have greatly contributed to the decline of the church and its influence. Most churches lack apologetics teaching for their young people (and their adults, for that matter). As a result, a very significant number of young people are leaving the church—and thus the decline of the influence of Christianity in this nation continues.

To help understand why millions of young adults have already left the church of their youth, a generous supporter of Answers in Genesis offered to fund a major research effort through America’s Research Group. (ARG is headed by the highly respected secular market researcher Britt Beemer, a frequent guest on national TV news programs.)

Britt’s company composed survey questions to find out why so many young adults are being lost from the church . . . plus why Christians are not having the influence on the culture that they once had (and thus why we are ultimately losing the “culture war” in America).

The results will shock you—and shock the church as a whole.

For example, our national survey discovered that children who grew up in evangelical homes are being “lost” from the church as early as elementary school, not primarily in college (as most might expect). Furthermore—in one of the biggest and most distressing surprises of the research—something you might call the “Sunday school syndrome” is contributing to the epidemic!

Already Gone is an alarming wake-up call for the church, because it reports on Britt Beemer’s research and shows how church programs and approaches to Christian education are failing—and thus millions of our young people are leaving the church. While the research statistics reveal the root issues of a huge problem, Already Gone shows how to fight back and reclaim our families, our churches, and our society for biblical truths.

The fact that warnings like 'Already Gone' are necessary is testimony to what happens when the church departs from upholding the truth of God's word.

Pastor Tony Bartolucci on Francis Beckwith: Drowning in the Tiber

For the last week I've been listening to a sermon series by Pastor Tony Bartolucci of Clarkson Community Church called Drowning in the Tiber. It's an ongoing series which so far has 6 parts. If you go to the link above, just click on each individual sermon to download and listen.
These sermons or lectures are in response to a book written by Professor Francis Beckwith, the former president of the Evangelical Theological Society, who recently reverted to Roman Catholicism. The book is called Return to Rome: Confessions of an Evangelical Catholic.
Pastor Bartolucci comes to many of the same conclusions that I have come to about Roman Catholicism after studying it's doctrines compared to God's word and studying Church history.

Loyola vs. Scripture pt. 2

Ignatius Loyola teaches that the Bride of Christ is the hierarchical Church, or the ruling magisterium, and that this ruling Bride Church has the 'same spirit as Christ our Lord... which governs and directs us for the salvation of our souls.' It is true that the church or Bride has the same mind and Spirit as Jesus Christ, but the true church is NOT the hierarchical magisterium of the Roman Catholic Church. The bride of Christ is the assembly or congregation of born-again believers; those who are saved by His blood through faith and trust in His word and abide in it. See the following:

1 Corinthians 2:
6 However, we speak wisdom among those who are mature, yet not the wisdom of this age, nor of the rulers of this age, who are coming to nothing. 7 But we speak the wisdom of God in a mystery, the hidden wisdom which God ordained before the ages for our glory, 8 which none of the rulers of this age knew; for had they known, they would not have crucified the Lord of glory.
9 But as it is written:

“ Eye has not seen, nor ear heard,
Nor have entered into the heart of man
The things which God has prepared for those who love Him.”

10 But God has revealed them to us through His Spirit. For the Spirit searches all things, yes, the deep things of God. 11 For what man knows the things of a man except the spirit of the man which is in him? Even so no one knows the things of God except the Spirit of God. 12 Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the Spirit who is from God, that we might know the things that have been freely given to us by God.
13 These things we also speak, not in words which man’s wisdom teaches but which the Holy Spirit teaches, comparing spiritual things with spiritual. 14 But the natural man does not receive the things of the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him; nor can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned. 15 But he who is spiritual judges all things, yet he himself is rightly judged by no one. 16 For “who has known the mind of the LORD that he may instruct Him?” But we have the mind of Christ.


In the above passage Paul tells us that 'we have the mind of Christ.' So who are 'we'?
We, the congregation of believers, ARE the Bride of Christ that has His mind and Spirit in us. See the following passages about the Bride:

Isaiah 61:10 (New King James Version)
10 I will greatly rejoice in the LORD,
My soul shall be joyful in my God;
For He has clothed me with the garments of salvation,
He has covered me with the robe of righteousness,
As a bridegroom decks himself with ornaments,
And as a bride adorns herself with her jewels.

Ephesians 5:
25 Husbands, love your wives, just as Christ also loved the church and gave Himself for her, 26 that He might sanctify and cleanse her with the washing of water by the word, 27 that He might present her to Himself a glorious church, not having spot or wrinkle or any such thing, but that she should be holy and without blemish. 28 So husbands ought to love their own wives as their own bodies; he who loves his wife loves himself. 29 For no one ever hated his own flesh, but nourishes and cherishes it, just as the Lord does the church. 30 For we are members of His body, of His flesh and of His bones.

2 Corinthians 11:
2 For I am jealous for you with godly jealousy. For I have betrothed you to one husband, that I may present you as a chaste virgin to Christ. 3 But I fear, lest somehow, as the serpent deceived Eve by his craftiness, so your minds may be corrupted from the simplicity[a] that is in Christ. 4 For if he who comes preaches another Jesus whom we have not preached, or if you receive a different spirit which you have not received, or a different gospel which you have not accepted—you may well put up with it!

Rev 5:
8 Now when He had taken the scroll, the four living creatures and the twenty-four elders fell down before the Lamb, each having a harp, and golden bowls full of incense, which are the prayers of the saints. 9 And they sang a new song, saying:


“ You are worthy to take the scroll,
And to open its seals;
For You were slain,
And have redeemed us to God by Your blood
Out of every tribe and tongue and people and nation,
10 And have made us[d] kings[e] and priests to our God;
And we[f] shall reign on the earth.”

Revelation 19:
7 Let us be glad and rejoice and give Him glory, for the marriage of the Lamb has come, and His wife has made herself ready.” 8 And to her it was granted to be arrayed in fine linen, clean and bright, for the fine linen is the righteous acts of the saints.

These passages tell us that Christ has purchased or redeemed the Bride with His blood by which the believers are washed clean from their sins and clothed with His righteousness. The believers are called and made new creations to walk in good works and be 'kings and priests' to reign on the earth when He returns. Believers are warned against listening to those who would preach a different gospel and a different Jesus which departs from the simplicity of the gospel preached by Jesus and His Apostles. We are told that we have the Holy Spirit and the mind of Christ as we are taught by the Spirit through His word: "that He might sanctify and cleanse her with the washing of water by the word, that He might present her to Himself a glorious church."

If the assembly of believers 'have the mind of Christ' then why do we need a heirarchy to tell us what is 'white' or 'black' as Loyola taught? If the hierarchy is teaching that something is 'black' which I as a believer (indwelt by the Spirit and taught by His word) know is 'white' or vice versa, then I flee from that false shepherd's voice as Jesus said His sheep would do who know His voice.

Again:

Isaiah 5
20 Woe to those who call evil good, and good evil;
Who put darkness for light, and light for darkness;
Who put bitter for sweet, and sweet for bitter!

Loyola vs. Scripture

"Thirteenth Rule. To be right in everything, we ought always to hold that the white which I see, is black, if the Hierarchical Church so decides it, believing that between Christ our Lord, the Bridegroom, and the Church, His Bride, there is the same Spirit which governs and directs us for the salvation of our souls. "St. Ignatius Loyola.

Isaiah 5
20 Woe to those who call evil good, and good evil;
Who put darkness for light, and light for darkness;
Who put bitter for sweet, and sweet for bitter!

A question of judgment

In a discussion thread under my post called 'A not-so-funny thing about Mary' Teresa (Moonshadow) asked me a question after I made the following statement about calling Mary by titles (in prayers or litanies) that are only given to God in the scriptures. Her question follows my statement below.

Teresa, far from it being necessary for salvation (and far from harmless), I believe it's blasphemy and idolatry to invoke Mary by these titles that are not given to her in the bible.

Teresa asked:
Do you who believe this, also believe that God is judging the sin in the Catholic church?

If you believe that God is judging the Catholic church for this, in what way and to what end? In other words, how is God's judgment of the Catholic church's "blasphemy and idolatry" evident to you and what's the purpose of God's judgment?

In the comment thread under my post called 'Mary as the Ark of the Covenant' I made a comment to another lady, Anna, about the same subject:

I'm sorry, but I think you are deceiving yourself (or repeating a deceptive statement made by RC apologists)if you think you are praising God for His works by calling Mary by His titles. If I want to praise God I praise Him directly. If I want to pray, I pray directly to God the Father, as Jesus taught us. He, and the Apostles, never taught us to praise anyone but God for our salvation, and never taught us to pray to anyone else but God. The scriptures are our rule. They are the only Word of God we have had since the apostles died. (And there are no other Apostles; in Revelation 21:14 it says "Now the wall of the city had twelve foundations, and on them were the names of the twelve apostles of the Lamb.")
In praising Mary using God's titles you ARE putting her in God's place, and putting her between you and God, when Jesus died to remove all barriers and make peace between us and God. You don't have to go through anyone else but Christ, and if you do you deny His finished work on the cross and nullify it in your life. You are making excuses for something that is wrong, and is against God's word, and He doesn't take it lightly when people do this. He also doesn't keep correcting those who are deceived, if they keep refusing to listen, but gives them up to their own devices until judgement comes. That is why we must fear God and listen to His word now when there is time.
See 2 Thessalonians 2:
9 The coming of the lawless one is according to the working of Satan, with all power, signs, and lying wonders, 10 and with all unrighteous deception among those who perish, because they did not receive the love of the truth, that they might be saved. 11 And for this reason God will send them strong delusion, that they should believe the lie, 12 that they all may be condemned who did not believe the truth but had pleasure in unrighteousness.

Under a post on Elena's (of mydomesticchurch.com) blog, Elena and I were discussing whether Jesus always corrected those who misunderstood or disbelieved Him, such as when some of the Jews left Him when He said they must eat His flesh and drink His blood. Elena asked:

Jennie, why did he allow the disciples to walk away from him if he didn't mean actually eating and digesting his body?

I answered:
Why did he allow the rich young ruler to
turn and walk away from Him when he didn't want to give up his riches?
Why did He allow people to misunderstand
His parables and other teachings and not run after them to correct them?

Elena came back:
EXACTLY!!

He told the rich young man the truth but he allowed him to make his own choice. Likewise he didn't water down his teaching on the Eucharist either. But you are free to take it or leave it - of course every decision has a consequence.

Later in the conversation I gave another example to show that Jesus did not always correct those who misunderstood Him:

Jesus does not always correct the listeners whether He is being literal OR figurative. Sometimes He lets them go without explaining anything. See the following passage where Jesus was speaking figuratively about His body being killed, but the Jews thought He literally meant the temple. He did not correct them.

John 2:18-22
18 So the Jews answered and said to Him, “What sign do You show to us, since You do these things?”
19 Jesus answered and said to them, “Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up.”
20 Then the Jews said, “It has taken forty-six years to build this temple, and will You raise it up in three days?”
21 But He was speaking of the temple of His body. 22 Therefore, when He had risen from the dead, His disciples remembered that He had said this to them;[c] and they believed the Scripture and the word which Jesus had said.

After the above conversation with Elena, it occurred to me that this related to Teresa's judgment question. Then, after answering Anna earlier today, it occurred to me that the answer I gave her related as well. What all came together in my mind is that, just as Jesus often let people misunderstand and disbelieve Him without correction (and certainly He didn't run after them when they left in unbelief after He had given them multiple explanations), in the same way, He will not continue to correct people forever but will at some point give them up to their deceptive beliefs and allow them to believe the lie, as it says in 2 Thessalonians 2:11. This should cause us to fear God and to seek Him in His word, because as I also said to Anna, the bible says: For You have magnified Your word above all Your name. Psalm 138:2
This 'giving them up to a strong delusion' is God's terrible judgment, until the final judgment day.

Psalm 138:2
2 I will worship toward Your holy temple,
And praise Your name
For Your lovingkindness and Your truth;
For You have magnified Your word above all Your name.

Also consider 1 Peter 4:17-18

17 For the time has come for judgment to begin at the house of God; and if it begins with us first, what will be the end of those who do not obey the gospel of God? 18 Now


“ If the righteous one is scarcely saved,
Where will the ungodly and the sinner appear?”

More discussion on John 6

Elena (of mydomesticchurch.com) and I were having a discussion here
about my 'I am the Bread of Life' (John 6) post. Following are two comments I made at the end of our discussion to clarify why this subject is so important.

The reason I keep stressing that Jesus is talking about His actual sacrifice on the cross, and about believing His word by faith, is that this is how the bible teaches that we are saved: by faith in Christ's sacrifice to take away our sin, which brings repentance and rebirth and the indwelling of the Holy Spirit.

Another thing that concerns me about Catholics besides that many are trusting in outward things for salvation (such as sacraments) is that they don't believe in or have assurance of salvation which comes by faith in Christ after we become a new creature by the indwelling of the Spirit who regenerates us and washes us by Christ's blood.

1 John 5:13
13 These things I have written to you who believe in the name of the Son of God, THAT YOU MAY KNOW THAT YOU HAVE ETERNAL LIFE, and that you may continue to believe in the name of the Son of God.

The Apology of Aristides The Philosopher

A couple of weeks ago our pastor read part of the Apology of Aristides to our congregation as part of the sermon, in order to encourage us and exhort us to living a holy christian life. I found it very interesting, convicting, and encouraging.
Following, after the editor's note, is the portion my pastor read.
Here is some more information about Aristides the Philosopher.

EDITOR'S NOTE: The Apology of Aristides, mentioned by Eusebius, St. Jerome, and other ancient writers and said to have been the inspiration for the great works of St. Justin Martyr, was considered lost until the late Nineteenth Century, when an Armenian fragment was discovered. Then in 1889 the full text in Syriac translation was found in the library of St. Catherine's in the Sinai. Ironically, it was then
realized that the work had never been lost at all: a slightly shortened version of it had been preserved in the well-known Life of St. Barlaam of India, by St. John of Damascus. (Since the numerous references to Greek gods would have made little impact
on an Indian audience, one may assume that St. John, writing for a Greek readership which would have found a denunciation of Vedic or Buddhist deities equally meaningless, decided to insert the Apology of Aristides as a sort of rough equivalent of whatever Barlaam actually preached to the Brahmins.)

St. Aristides delivered the Apology around the year 125, when Hadrian visited Athens [Eusebius, H.E. IV, iii].

The Apology of Aristides
Here follows the defence which Aristides the philosopher made before Hadrian the King on behalf of reverence for God....

XV. But the Christians, O King, while they went about and made search, have found the truth; and as we learned from their writings, they have come nearer to truth and genuine knowledge than the rest of the nations. For they know and trust in God, the Creator of heaven and of earth, in whom and from whom are all things, to whom there is no other god as companion, from whom they received commandments which they engraved upon their minds and observe in hope and expectation of the world which is to come. Wherefore they do not commit adultery nor fornication, nor bear false witness, nor embezzle what is held in pledge, nor covet what is not theirs. They honour father and mother, and show kindness to those near to them; and whenever they are judges, they judge uprightly. They do not worship idols (made) in the image of man; and whatsoever they would not that others should do unto them, they do not to others; and of the food which is consecrated to idols they do not eat, for they are pure. And their oppressors they appease (lit: comfort) and make them their friends; they do good to their enemies; and their women, O King, are pure as virgins, and their daughters are modest; and their men keep themselves from every unlawful union and from all uncleanness, in the hope of a recompense to come in the other world. Further, if one or other of them have bondmen and bondwomen or children, through love towards them they persuade them to become Christians, and when they have done so, they call them brethren without distinction. They do not worship strange gods, and they go their way in all modesty and cheerfulness. Falsehood is not found among them; and they love one another, and from widows they do not turn away their esteem; and they deliver the orphan from him who treats him harshly. And he, who has, gives to him who has not, without boasting. And when they see a stranger, they take him in to their homes and rejoice over him as a very brother; for they do not call them brethren after the flesh, but brethren after the spirit and in God. And whenever one of their poor passes from the world, each one of them according to his ability gives heed to him and carefully sees to his burial. And if they hear that one of their number is imprisoned or afflicted on account of the name of their Messiah, all of them anxiously minister to his necessity, and if it is possible to redeem him they set him free. And if there is among them any that is poor and needy, and if they have no spare food, they fast two or three days in order to supply to the needy their lack of food. They observe the precepts of their Messiah with much care, living justly and soberly as the Lord their God commanded them. Every morning and every hour they give thanks and praise to God for His loving-kindnesses toward them; and for their food and their drink they offer thanksgiving to Him. And if any righteous man among them passes from the world, they rejoice and offer thanks to God; and they escort his body as if he were setting out from one place to another near. And when a child has been born to one of them, they give thanks to God; and if moreover it happen to die in childhood, they give thanks to God the more, as for one who has passed through the world without sins. And further if they see that any one of them dies in his ungodliness or in his sins, for him they grieve bitterly, and sorrow as for one who goes to meet his doom.

XVI. Such, O King, is the commandment of the law of the Christians, and such is their manner of life. As men who know God, they ask from Him petitions which are fitting for Him to grant and for them to receive. And thus they employ their whole lifetime. And since they know the loving-kindnesses of God toward them, behold! for their sake the glorious things which are in the world flow forth to view. And verily, they are those who found the truth when they went about and made search for it; and from what we considered, we learned that they alone come near to a knowledge of the truth. And they do not proclaim in the ears of the multitude the kind deeds they do, but are careful that no one should notice them; and they conceal their giving just as he who finds a treasure and conceals it. And they strive to be righteous as those who expect to behold their Messiah, and to receive from Him with great glory the promises made concerning them. And as for their words and their precepts, O King, and their glorying in their worship, and the hope of earning according to the work of each one of them their recompense which they look for in another world,-you may learn about these from their writings. It is enough for us to have shortly informed your Majesty concerning the conduct and the truth of the Christians. For great indeed, and wonderful is their doctrine to him who will search into it and reflect upon it. And verily, this is a new people, and there is something divine (lit: "a divine admixture") in the midst of them.